From Silos to Synergies: How BSH Aligns IT with Business – with Boyana Todorova & Stefanie Bayer, BSH

00:00:00: We said, okay before we do anything else now.

00:00:02: We need to align what our purpose is?

00:00:06: So the classical-purpose question why are we spending this time together?

00:00:10: What do you want to achieve?

00:00:11: and I think that was a game changer here.

00:00:30: Hi!

00:00:30: And welcome to The Data Culture podcast.

00:00:32: Florian Wiegelmeier is with me again because we have the data festival series.

00:00:38: Today we interview two speakers of the data festivals both from BSH Home Appliances.

00:00:45: We have Stefanie Bayer, Head of Corporate Reporting Systems.

00:00:49: She's more looking at the topic data analytics AI from a business perspective and Bojana Todorovic.

00:00:56: And she is head of Data Analytics Cross applications coming more from their IT side.

00:01:01: Together I think we could find some interesting perspectives on this topic didn't we Florian?

00:01:07: Yeah definitely!

00:01:08: So in this episode Bojanna and Steffi will describe how they identified the key problems around their analytics infrastructure and organization.

00:01:18: So, they have kind of described a tension between business domains in the central analytics team And this described also way forward like what they learned How to approach that topic?

00:01:30: The interesting part is that it bottom up But I think now's time to dive into it.

00:01:36: Absolutely!

00:01:37: Let us listen in.

00:01:38: Enjoy the episode.

00:01:40: Hi, Carlson and Florian.

00:01:42: Thanks for having us!

00:01:45: Also from my side great to be here today with you.

00:01:48: Great to have both.

00:01:49: Let's

00:01:50: jump right away into the topic.

00:01:52: I would say so at Data Festival You had a very good presentation on the topic From silos to synergies around the topic of data analytics.

00:02:02: And how do you create as the title says Synergies between different business teams but also the central IT team?

00:02:11: I would suggest let's start with the challenge you had in the beginning.

00:02:15: Bojana, maybe you have the central IT and data perspective?

00:02:19: Maybe you could start... And we can then listen to Steffi's perspective which is maybe the counterpart here

00:02:26: When they started.

00:02:27: actually We still have this problem and working on it together with Steffie and all other domain owners.

00:02:33: from business side We have quite fragmented landscape on BSH site We have some business areas who work mainly with SAP data in SAP analytics systems.

00:02:45: And we have others, who are using non-SCP systems like Power BI for visualizations and Redshift for storing data and analyzing data as well.

00:02:59: So it was really hard to cross business area projects and combine data from these areas that have different analytic systems.

00:03:12: That was our biggest challenge, and of course when AI came everybody wanted to speak with their data.

00:03:18: Everybody wanted to have own solution And where we saw the fragmentation is getting bigger and bigger.

00:03:24: It's impossible to combine this data and use full potential of AI.

00:03:28: Steffi how do you see it?

00:03:30: Yeah, so definitely.

00:03:32: I think that's a common thing in big corporations with every department and every function builds its own solutions.

00:03:39: That is very common.

00:03:40: it was also highly practical in the past because instead of waiting for six months for central IT to do something you have to stand in line or discuss budget.

00:03:52: most people prefer isolated solutions because when a sales team in Spain can create their dashboard or the analysis quickly for steering instead of talking four weeks with IT.

00:04:06: And that was okay, In the past I could also see what is very challenging.

00:04:11: until today Areas in these age are very, very different.

00:04:16: So operations is very different from controlling also from sales and they have a different maturity rate or grade.

00:04:27: when it comes to digitalization They have different problems.

00:04:30: we work with different systems.

00:04:32: We have difference stakeholders of different expectations some some more focused on transactional data, others are more focused on data with business logic like my area.

00:04:43: So that makes it very hard to create synergies or identify synergies and also find a point where we can reach them in ways you could benefit from.

00:04:56: That was the past but then came time when all these dashboards popped up.

00:05:02: Yeah, so suddenly you had a nicer way of representing your data not only Excel and PowerPoint but in dashboards.

00:05:11: And people yeah we have more and more data off course with digitalization More Data now also the AI especially my area in logistics.

00:05:23: they started to create cross-functional dashboards areas.

00:05:30: But we found it's not so easy because we have different dimensions and different KPIs, for example Revenue is a very prominent example.

00:05:41: or also sales quantities in our company Because for sales quantities there are five different definitions of the company And also revenue is defined differently in the sales area than in the controlling.

00:05:56: Yeah, because different parts are included or not included.

00:06:00: So that makes it really hard but that was the starting point and the challenge.

00:06:05: That's why those areas were already interested a little bit ahead of time I would say our front runners.

00:06:13: they came together on a voluntary basis to work together in bed yeah And we founded this so-called like KPI pool, so we found it like a data pool.

00:06:26: We put together Data for example from logistics and controlling And he started aligning on the voluntary basis by yeah from two areas.

00:06:37: How they can harmonize that?

00:06:39: Yeah So that was.

00:06:40: but that was a coalition of revealing I would say And there were also other areas, but it was all on a voluntary basis.

00:06:47: But it was also time of great energy because you could really create something and people are internally motivated in everything.

00:06:56: In the end we saw that power of execution is very limited.

00:07:01: at first they're beginning I would say

00:07:06: What both described as not new I mean silos, non-aligned metrics for decision making is as old as IT or data processing in companies.

00:07:21: So my question would be why now?

00:07:23: Bojan already said AI is a driver but are there other drivers?

00:07:28: Is it dynamics of the business?

00:07:31: did anything happen that you say they're really more drive behind this topic to try and solve it?

00:07:39: I was one of the main reasons.

00:07:41: So everybody wants to speak with their data, and... To make that available our business areas are now more willing to do a compromise And move towards new solutions as well, technical solution.

00:07:54: That's a big chance potential for us to make some major architectural changes.

00:08:00: Until now it really hard.

00:08:05: Every area has their own preferred way of working, especially with data and there are certain reasons for it.

00:08:11: As Stephie mentioned logistics and finance work quite good together but its really hard to get data from marketing or HR With the current platforms Its impossible do this exchange.

00:08:29: It's not impossible.

00:08:31: As Stephie mentioned, we have already quite good solutions like our KPI pool which was a technical solution.

00:08:39: Harmonizing data and putting it together on the platform.

00:08:41: but as soon you want to go in details and deep dive We have lots of limitations And if would like to remove these limitations It will allow us To allow business users or decision makers Go almost deeper inside the data and get answers as fast possible.

00:08:59: So I think what Bojana pointed towards was that IT is driving a certain standardization, so let's be underlying notion and businesses of course feeding it.

00:09:13: Before everything was fragmented every function could really build the isolated solutions optimized for their own purposes which was good.

00:09:22: but now this this external pressure, I would say forces more standardization.

00:09:27: And you see that you cannot win from a business side if you just concentrate on your own issues.

00:09:32: so people seek for partnerships.

00:09:37: of course the biggest fear is they have specific needs and we always want to fulfill these.

00:09:46: yeah?

00:09:49: maybe come to that later, but IT is just driving standardization for the technology aspect and costs from a cost perspective.

00:09:58: But it's sacrificing business benefits for that.

00:10:02: And so I think together now i'm taking really other perspectives together when we yeah then they Come Together From Business side and join forces and also formulate this requirements Most of them, it's really hard to find requirements for every dimension or function.

00:10:26: But at least the majority we can then have a louder voice I would say and more power also towards IT.

00:10:35: in a positive way i would say Of course.

00:10:38: so we want to position ourselves as our group.

00:10:42: We had this global reporting analytics group.

00:10:45: We haven't introduced that yet, but we are with Global Reporting Analytics Group at BSH in the data and AI target operating model led by Bojana and me.

00:10:56: So our intent is to position group as a business partner also to IT.

00:11:04: Because for IT, it's really hard to collect all these requirements from the business side.

00:11:08: I think that is one challenge because everyone says they want this way and other ones wants it that way.

00:11:15: but what does becoming ground?

00:11:17: And I cannot fulfill everything.

00:11:18: so its not efficient!

00:11:20: From business-side of course we have to position our Our needs and I think it's more efficient if we first align on this side.

00:11:30: what is really important?

00:11:32: And that's already the first challenge to talk to each other because they are not used too bad in The company.

00:11:38: It was not necessary In the past, and then speak with one voice with IT and Create such a partnership and i think That's Really A new Thing and be a nice thing also To do.

00:11:50: but its hard work.

00:11:54: It's really hard work.

00:11:55: And alignment is the key topic, and I must confess it doesn't come so naturally to me – alignment and patience.

00:12:06: That why it's good for business as well like Steffi.

00:12:11: Our game change is that we are co-moderating this group together.

00:12:15: So Steffie uses her superpower, Alignment….

00:12:20: What she did in the past was very impressive especially She had lots of one-to-ones with every single business owner.

00:12:28: And, of course they have completely different levels.

00:12:30: some are very analytics-pronged and do dashboards on their own.

00:12:35: They even integrate data in there.

00:12:36: others aren't that far.

00:12:38: They request dashboards at IT site and the integration is also done completely by IT.

00:12:44: You need to go one by one ask what exactly we're doing it?

00:12:47: Of course you get different wishes.

00:12:50: I would like to use Microsoft Dynamics Data, I would like to use SAP data.

00:12:55: I would love to use GFK data for example and everybody wants the have it as easy as possible.

00:13:01: And Steffi had this patience To listen all these requests and also provide our vision.

00:13:09: Hey we need to do compromises We need find one common ground in future so that we can have our data harmonized on a platform if possible of course and easy to be used by every tool or AI.

00:13:25: And that was really the big thing, this one-to-ones conversation listening understanding and moving every participant towards our common goal on vision.

00:13:35: There's a pretty interesting pattern throughout what you're saying That is that A lot of what are doing Is coming almost like a grassroots initiative from bottom up From people who feel pain and sitting together in one room other than a top-down initiative from like, senior manager or an executive.

00:13:55: What would you say is the big advantage of going that way?

00:13:58: Of... Going to business domains and seeking alliances if you wish?

00:14:04: Yes it's very good observation for your side.

00:14:07: It was true.

00:14:09: we actually had a top down initiative so our group was founded as Top Down Initiative.

00:14:14: There was an official mandate started two years ago.

00:14:17: So before I talked about this coalition of the willing, and then in twenty-twenty four it changed because we implemented here in these age for data and AI model with three different groups where they are reporting analytics group a igroup and a data management group And every area needed to send delegates to these groups mandatory Lee um and he said oh wow now We really expected a big change because now we have this mandate and can work on that together.

00:15:01: Bojan and me had a good feeling.

00:15:03: And then we head to this workshop last year where he said, okay now you can talk about our strategy.

00:15:09: so they did something.

00:15:09: So what is it?

00:15:11: What do really want to achieve?

00:15:12: and when be noticed in the feedback?

00:15:14: people totally surprised that most of her people said I actually don't know why am In this group but so what are we doing?

00:15:22: What does our purpose and Is it isn't really necessary and i don't have time and i have my own problems.

00:15:30: I mean, of course we have so many projects going on reorganizations new product lines and so forth.

00:15:37: Yeah?

00:15:38: So you were really shocked but i was shocked at least!

00:15:42: I would say it was really back to zero.

00:15:46: And yeah... We needed a couple days to digest that and think okay what do we now?

00:15:53: throw everything in vain the organization is not ready and we continue like it did in the past, but he said no.

00:16:02: He takes this as a challenge that there's motivation to think about what you can do

00:16:08: differently.".

00:16:09: And when they say okay before we do anything else now?

00:16:14: We need to align with our purposes.

00:16:18: so the classical purpose question why are we spending time together?

00:16:22: What Do You Want To Achieve?

00:16:25: And I think that was the game changer here, and it's also something that is not so common in cross-functional to think about what we can achieve together.

00:16:37: It's kind of a cultural thing... We said okay if you don't continue with all the group on working because there are just too many voices who want to volunteer And was very happy to see we had three or four volunteers.

00:16:53: So I was involved, but also from different operations areas like development quality and so forth.

00:17:01: We also looked that you have different systems represented SAP non-SAP systems And then he started in October working.

00:17:10: We had sessions every two weeks, we also have an external support to make life easier and really use only the brain less work on administration stuff... ...and our goal was something in February with another workshop by end of Q-One that we wanted.

00:17:31: purpose and vision The data festival yeah, and that was really something.

00:17:39: then they said okay.

00:17:40: We need to all agree on bad first.

00:17:43: we need To work it from the bottom.

00:17:45: you need to agree an.

00:17:46: every participant has Yeah as the obligation to go into there.

00:17:53: You also talk about what is our role because that was a kind of Yeah.

00:17:58: So what is my real role?

00:17:59: I don't have time, i'm so busy and I have all of the other stuff!

00:18:03: What's your expectation?

00:18:05: because everybody is afraid it just too

00:18:07: much?!

00:18:08: We said okay... The roles for people in this group are multi-clicators.

00:18:13: You're not supposed to do everything on you own but you need be a voice into an area.

00:18:18: You need talk about the needs or find people who can support different initiatives in the area, so all kinds of stuff like that.

00:18:32: And I think that yeah...I mean i also did it for first time like that but so far is good and we have everybody now on boat.

00:18:41: We had a final meeting with top management where they presented that But was really home run because you already had these alignments up front one by one gradually, so we had a draft and then I think before Christmas.

00:19:02: We had some alignments and when they worked in the feedback... They had this onsite workshop in February with everyone also discussed very intensively.

00:19:14: i would say it's also controversially definitely but my message to people is always if you want I give you the voice and we want to position ourselves as business partners towards a key, but it's not coming for free.

00:19:29: So he will need really be engaged yeah?

00:19:33: Yeah We will not deliver everything on a silver plate for you And you just can sit there in complain.

00:19:39: so if There is a clear expectation If you want to change something then you need to do Something from that!

00:19:44: So if You Want To Do Something For Power VI Then Uh...You Need To Start The Initiative For Power Vi AI For example, if you want to have a connection to a JNI tool then okay we can do that but when find people who will work with you on it.

00:20:05: And then Bojan and me are the ones promoting towards top management finding money so forth.

00:20:12: So yeah its real cultural change.

00:20:15: I would say

00:20:18: I'd be interested in this engagement question, so how do i get people on board?

00:20:24: You said first of all there was a group of the willing.

00:20:26: The ones that started.

00:20:28: is there any pattern?

00:20:29: and thinking about our listeners yeah... And are they able to start a group ?

00:20:35: Is there property for these that you could identify why they were actually willing Beyond this group?

00:20:47: and then obviously I would expect that the reservations, yeah.

00:20:52: The problems basically would increase to get everyone And possibly you will have more questions maybe people actively resisting To be here.

00:21:03: So what's the secret sauce?

00:21:05: How did those people also on board?

00:21:08: You mentioned purpose as an important part of it.

00:21:11: Are there others?

00:21:12: Yeah What my theory is, they are not interested in the technology itself.

00:21:18: So I think if you're just saying that it's the best technology or most cost efficient technology doesn't care.

00:21:28: so they want solutions to their problems.

00:21:30: That why this listening thing is important In terms of finding out what a real problem and addressing exactly that problem And also for our purpose strategy, we said that we cannot save a bird.

00:21:45: We will not do everything!

00:21:47: Let's rather focus on the real important things... ...that most of us are interested in and do less than more.

00:21:54: but do what right?

00:21:56: I think this is key to getting people onboard or finding out where their pain points are.. ..and really doing something for them.

00:22:09: German Selbstwirksamkeit, that they see okay I have a problem.

00:22:13: I do hear something and it creates positive change for me also in my area but i can sell them as well.

00:22:21: so thats the key.

00:22:24: why its so much work because often people dont know what their real problems are but really identifying what the underlying reason is and what, in the coming round it's also a cross between people.

00:22:40: It was very hard I think that's how we got those who are rather resisting.

00:22:47: We were quite honest.

00:22:49: I would say.

00:22:50: Bojana said okay if you only want the people who are really burning for this topic I don't care about hierarchy But I need the people who are really burning for that topic and have like a vision also.

00:23:05: Have an idea where we can head for it, as if you're trying to help because partially the picket-people identify those in their organization And pull them into our group or at least working groups.

00:23:23: Completely agree with you Steffi?

00:23:25: That was our approach but there is focused on technology.

00:23:30: from my side, I would say that technology matters a lot to business.

00:23:33: Business is usually fond of their technologies they are using and don't want to lose it because they have already the skills but do not want to invest too much time in acquiring new skills – not every area though some areas really quite prone to technology.

00:23:52: What was maybe a bit supporting for our group.

00:23:54: At the same time, when we started there was an initiative on IT side to review our analytics architecture.

00:24:05: And that is a first draft presented by our group and I would say it's a bit scared after this presentation because they will lose a lot!

00:24:16: That also helped us not so much but willingness to support and be involved, because with this group we gave every business owner the option to deliver their requirements as they said.

00:24:31: Which are problems?

00:24:32: What would you like to solve within your

00:24:34: architecture?".

00:24:35: And that's how they get more involved in choosing the architecture as well not really technically but on a business requirement side.

00:24:46: It is of course not at the biggest success for our group.

00:24:50: It was a big supporting and helping also focusing on technology, new technology in your architecture.

00:24:58: I think it pays in what I said earlier.

00:24:59: they see something is happening an IT side.

00:25:02: if i'm on my own ,I cannot do anything about that.

00:25:06: just have to accept for this coming by bundling our requirements by formulating we have the power really speak on eye level with IT .

00:25:17: And thats whats motivating most of us people.

00:25:20: Yeah, because it's giving.

00:25:22: yeah.

00:25:22: Because we are not just helpless and sitting in waiting for the things to come because changes that coming very quickly right now so people get overwhelmed by it.

00:25:33: uh I'm feeling helpless.

00:25:35: It gives you a position of power would say.

00:25:41: also

00:25:42: do they have an example where you can influence the IT architecture or tool choices?

00:25:49: Yeah, that's exactly what Bojana said.

00:25:51: We are currently discussing the new platform strategy because our vision also... Our biggest pain point in reporting and I think everybody can relate to it is that most people obviously finding the right data from the right places.

00:26:08: We're sitting there connecting to different systems, downloading every new cell and compiling the data cross-referencing a new mappings so forth.

00:26:18: So that's alot of work most people do involved in reporting And it also really come an agreement with our group.

00:26:25: we want solve that.

00:26:27: The only solution is... Problem is increasing now.

00:26:32: The more data and AI, to the question earlier what's changing?

00:26:39: And I think we all agree also from a business side that they need to bring their data together.

00:26:45: Also IT has come with the same conclusion.

00:26:48: They want to provide such common data source.

00:26:53: but of course we are concerned it still Compliant with our requirements, so are we getting the right data in a right form?

00:27:01: How difficult is it to connect?

00:27:04: We also at least my team.

00:27:06: It's very IT close.

00:27:07: I would say they're doing a lot of things.

00:27:09: Also in that system directly can be do the same still and then you set up Yeah.

00:27:15: So what does the role of business?

00:27:17: but this rule of IT so many many things better involved And i think now we can Offer a platform where we can really talk on iLevel about these things.

00:27:27: We had like an Excel list that he has some criterias and really also went one by One to every Business area, and set down And they could list their requirements.

00:27:39: yeah That was also very interesting because we are not used to it.

00:27:43: It's really.

00:27:44: it was something you need to learn.

00:27:46: I would say so some quite ahead because we are closer to IT.

00:27:50: Some just said, yeah I want all my data but didn't know how to formulate.

00:27:55: so they started with an area that is close to IT topics.

00:28:01: They did the first draft and then everybody went through it added on or changed something.

00:28:07: We collected their requirements from fifteen areas And Boyana is one who's when mobilizing IT and motivates them to talk with us.

00:28:19: That's also hard work, so I think it is really a cultural change that we are trying... ...to bring everybody together from across business.

00:28:31: Business needs to talk in the line but also within IT.

00:28:36: there are different parties that need to be aligned.

00:28:39: So there was a lot of alignment going on And once they were running around gather all the people and opinions.

00:28:48: And at least bring everybody to the table, of course we cannot decide but if... Atleast you can make different opinions transparent.

00:28:59: I think that last sentences are pretty good to zoom out a little bit because We figured it out.

00:29:06: You identified your problem?

00:29:08: You had big successes already in bringing people into the table To talk with each other.

00:29:14: You're in the process of this culture change to align with each other on certain projects, on certain definitions maybe.

00:29:23: Which is certainly an ongoing topic right?

00:29:26: If you look into other organizations there might be even a fourth step and we see that they try to bring more ownership for example KPIs or something like data product into business domains.

00:29:40: Is it something your looking at too?

00:29:45: Of course, when we started our group actually that was the main focus.

00:29:53: Getting the ownership and defining which are the most important KPIs for every domain who is owning them?

00:29:59: And who can answer questions in case there any here.

00:30:06: once again if you did a great work gathering all these KPIs from every business owner with corresponding data sources it We have everything documented, it's in our data library.

00:30:23: It is being used.

00:30:24: but let us say we see there are need for more investment in this area and that what now planning to strengthen a bit especially towards the new AI ready data lake.

00:30:43: so you will start once again at least if your plan which KPI should be provided for the co-company per domain, once again with corresponding data owner and try to check in next steps if we can do some harmonization so that KPIs are used via chat interface.

00:31:07: Yeah I totally agree but this is important.

00:31:10: when i started doing this stuff and talking about reporting analytics within different areas most of people don't report analytics agree.

00:31:18: The hardest thing if you are working with cross-functional data, for example quality has hardly any own data.

00:31:24: They only work without that data.

00:31:26: and the most challenging thing is to find out who can I ask or where do i find the data?

00:31:33: And Who Can I Ask To Get Access To The Data?

00:31:37: So I think thats a challenge people know about.

00:31:39: That's why the first initiative start as what I observed from business side Definition of data owner and data steward, we have rolled it out from IT side.

00:31:53: But I don't yet feel really an organization that needs to work on getting this ownership in reality.

00:32:02: There's still some invests to do.

00:32:07: Any plans?

00:32:08: How can you do that?

00:32:09: You already had the idea in mind because there is a problem more or less everyone has.

00:32:15: honestly Any tips, any ideas are always welcome.

00:32:22: Question to IT would say?

00:32:25: Start small don't maybe expect a big bank with the Big Data Product being published and available for everybody.

00:32:34: start with The most important KPIs per domain And once you have that then you can expand into a big data product.

00:32:47: But ownership I will say it's not the problem of IT It's really the problem of business.

00:32:52: Yeah, at least regarding these top KPIs we are starting an initiative again... We said in September that they're going to have a workshop where all participants think about what other most important KPIs you can think off in your area or what you need from other areas and then want do an overview and prioritize.

00:33:16: Again it is not getting everything into this data Lake or platform, but start small.

00:33:23: But at least have a roadmap.

00:33:25: what we want to include because with every KPI will also do some harmonization.

00:33:30: now that's it's more of the The challenge.

00:33:35: so be you want to get everybody in the boat agree on probably they start with revenue I guess and sales quantity, they bring it then in this data source when we see okay analyze what are the different definitions get that people really address with people who need to be involved too.

00:33:54: Get an alignment And try a tool to enforce that.

00:33:59: I think It's not like Bojana said having Like a governance scheme may say all of the data is classified as data product.

00:34:08: when we can assign it to a data owner, is really that they are living this role of data ownership.

00:34:14: So I'm responsible for this and need think about who's using how its defined?

00:34:21: Somebody asked me in challenges on what am doing.

00:34:24: so i have two align here talking with each other or compromise maybe also changing the way im using.

00:34:33: today.

00:34:35: We have done that in small, the sales team for revenue because it's really a pain but we had different definition when they do this system.

00:34:45: So besides our global group you already had one-on-one initiative and sat down and said okay how can be aligned with?

00:34:54: How could create common data connection where we feed all systems of their systems?

00:35:00: so everybody is working on same terms?

00:35:03: But yeah, I think grabbing really important single data products and working on them together is probably creating.

00:35:13: Again they need to feel okay.

00:35:16: if i put in this energy an effort... ...I have a positive outcome then we are also ready to move from there

00:35:24: And our group has the success for it as ownership.

00:35:29: Already there, sharing is the problem of what I see.

00:35:32: Everybody wants to have numbers from other areas but nobody really want's share their own number and when you notice for example in last two months that was a success story which it actually again.

00:35:44: on new marketing they were requested by marketing site on financial KPIs And usually request would go like marketing scams to IT ask for KPIs.

00:35:54: we got finance and asked permission But as we had our group, marketing was able to speak to finance directly explain the business need and that's made it much easier because of course if the business needs explained why he doesn't sound important at least.

00:36:15: That is my feeling.

00:36:18: so our group isn't nearly us sharing.

00:36:21: That makes a lot of sense.

00:36:23: I think that makes, like the example to the end make it really relatable as The entire episode.

00:36:29: to be honest To you the problems we've really had or were really here from a lot practitioners out there?

00:36:35: um i Think the total way You describe today From identification Of the problem over how your approach did How are you set up a possibility to exchange on their problem and bring people together?

00:36:51: examples you had towards the end really explain well how you solved it.

00:36:55: I think that's an episode many people can learn from, hopefully in practice later and thanks for your insights on this.

00:37:04: You're welcome!

00:37:05: Once again thankyou for having us... ...and letting share our journey

00:37:11: Absolutely.

00:37:12: And then we wish you very good luck with your journey or on the way but it sounds quite successful and quiet, really forward-looking that you found a good way to bring BSH forward.

00:37:23: So congratulations and good luck!

00:37:26: Yeah

00:37:27: thank you thanks for having us in have a great day.